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When does drinking alcohol become a sin-or is it?
How or when does drinking become a sin? If it is, why did Jesus turn water into wine? I know the bible says not to become addicted to wine (which I was before I was saved). This post is just a general question, I do not drink anymore. I know that if we become drunk it could lead to temptation. My fiance likes to occasionally have a couple of beers-is this o.k?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by JB on
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If drinking alcohol constitutes a sin, then would not eating fall under the same category? What is the difference in overeating and making one sick, or obese, not considering the body as the temple of God and destroying it by doing so? There are a lot of wines that have less alcohol content than does some of the med’s we or some take.
The reason I think that the wine mentioned in the bible is pure; is because,
He says in Ephesians 5:17-18 (KJV)
Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. “And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess“; but be filled with the Spirit; When we drink in excess, leads to poor judgements. and therefore we would be unwise.
I don’t think that the water afore mentioned would make one drunk; would it?
If it does, then why go through the process of crushing grapes?
I’m not saying I believe this just to justify my sipping a little now and then, lol, but let some know that they need not come under self condemnation for having a little wine with a meal, or a stand alone drink for a relaxing moment after a hard days work.
However I will always refer back to the scripture in Romans 14, what ever is not of faith is sin.
Faith= conviction and or persuasion.
Also , Colossians 2:16-18 (KJV)
Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,
Some might think of this as being a “Joe Boyce, 3:16”
So my advice to all, would be, if it bothers you to participate in anything, golfing on Sunday, oops! Or not going to church every time the doors are open, Then don’t do the things that bother you!
Sounds a little like a [confucius says] as well.
Eat drink and be merry, for tomorrow ye may die!
Be blessed!!!!
Joe
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Permalink Reply by David Velasquez on
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Ii have been seeking reliable sources to the support that the wine of the ancient days was alot different than the one today. That would add to the reasons why one should not drink. Anyone has clear reliable sources? I have the following on file.
http://www.gospeljohn.com/ng_drinking.htm
Is Wine Today Like New Testament Wine?
Many wine-drinking [so-called] "Christians" today mistakenly assume that what the New Testament meant by wine is identical to wine used today. This, however, is false. In fact today's wine is by biblical definitions "strong drink," and hence is forbidden in the Bible! What the Bible frequently meant by wine was basically purified water.
Stein researched wine-drinking in the ancient world, in Jewish sources, and in the Bible.(7) He pointed out that wine in Homer's day was twenty parts water and one part wine (Odyssey 9.208-9). Pliny referred to wine as eight parts water and one part wine (Natural History 14.6-54). According to Aristophanes, it was stronger: three parts water and two parts wine. Other classical Greek writers spoke of other mixtures: Euenos -- three parts water, one part wine; Hesiod -- three to one, water to wine; Alexis -- four to one: Diocles and Anacreon -- two to one: and Ion -- three to one. The average was about three or four parts of water to one part of wine. Sometimes in the ancient world one part water would be mixed with one part wine; this was considered strong wine. And anyone who drank wine unmixed was looked on as a Scythian, a barbarian. That means the Greeks would say today, "You Americans are barbarians -- drinking straight wine." For example, Athenaeus quoted Mnesitheus of Athens as saying, "in daily intercourse, to those who drink it moderately it gives good cheer; but if you overstep the bounds it brings violence. Mix it half and half and you get madness; unmixed -- bodily collapse."(8) Here is a pagan saying, "Half and half is madness, and unmixed wine brings death."
Stein also observes that "in several instances in the Old Testament a distinction is made between 'wine' and 'strong drink'" (e.g., Lev. 10:8-9). Strong drink is one thing, wine is another thing. The same distinction is made in Deuteronomy 14:26; 29:6; Judges 13:4; and elsewhere. According to the Talmud the "wine" used in the Passover meal was three parts water and one part wine (cf. 2 Macc. 15:39).(9)
It may also be that the wine Jesus miraculously provided at the wedding in Cana (John 2: 1-11) was a similar drink, that is, wine mixed with water. The word oinos ("wine") refers sometimes to fermented grape juice (e.g., Eph. 5:18) and sometimes to fresh, not fully fermented grape juice (e.g., Rev. 19:15). Furthermore, in ancient times not many beverages were safe to drink. Stein indicates that in the ancient world water could be made safe in one of several ways. It could be boiled, but this was tedious and costly. Or it could be filtered, but this was not a safe method. Or some wine could be put in the water to kill the germs -- one part wine with three or four parts water.
Wine today has a much higher level of alcohol than wine in the New Testament. In fact in New Testament times one would need to drink twenty-two glasses of wine in order to consume the large amount of alcohol in two martinis today. Stein humorously notes, "In other words, it is possible to become intoxicated from wine mixed with three parts water, but one's drinking would probably affect the bladder long before the mind."(10)
Though fermented wine was drunk in Bible times and though the Bible approved of wine-drinking, one needs to remember that the alcoholic content was much less than that of wine today. What is used today is not the wine of the New Testament! Therefore Christians ought not drink wine, beer, or other alcoholic beverages for they are actually "strong drink" and are forbidden in Scripture. Even ancient pagans did not drink what some [so-called] "Christians" drink today! Thus it is wrong to argue that since people in Bible times drank wine, Christians today can do the same. Properly speaking, people then drank purified water. New Testament wine was basically a water-purification method. It was not an unsafe liquor; it was a safe liquid. But in America purifying water with wine is unnecessary, and plenty of nonaddictive beverages are available
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But the bible would also say not to "be given to much wine". This would imply that the alcohol content was more than "purified water". Because it would take a tremendous amount of purified water with a tiny about of alchohol to cause drunkeness, which it seems is the reason for not drinking "much wine". I appreciate the desire people have to say that the wine we have is completely different, and I am sure it is true, but it is not so different that people weren't in the habit of getting drunk on the wine ofJesus day. So though I appreciate the sources above the content of the scriptures seem to indicate that there was still a danger of drunkenness from the wine of that day. The NT says "be not drunk with wine, but filled with the spirit". it seems drunkeness on wine was common in new testament times. Someone would have to be pretty committed to drunkenness in order to drink 22 glasses of water-wine! But then again, before meeting Christ i was a pretty committed fellow! hehe!
My point of course is not that it is ok for us to drink wine, beer or any other alcoholic beverage, I am just responding to the cultural info presented by the article above. I am not disagreeing with all the info, I am sure at least the majority it's accurate, just pointing out that there was also a common practice of drinking a kind of wine that was seemingly easier to produce drunkeness than that mentioned above.
One last note. I know of brothers and sisters who have a glass of wine here and there. These church members have never had a problem drinking in their lives and are Godly people. I Do Not think of them anyless than those who chose not to drink.
Romans 14 – however teaches that if something is sin to you then its sin and don’t do it, but don’t try to impose that conviction on someone else.
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Permalink Reply by Carla on
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Hi Everyone,
Pride can come in many forms.
In the case of abstinence from alcohol, it is extremely important that we must stay humble, and know that one of the reasons we are abstaining, is because we can easily be lead astray or lead others astray by example. We must recognize our weaknesses. When we say we don't drink alcohol, it's not because we have a 'holier than thou' attitude about it... It's because we want to honour God and be led by The Holy Spirit in all parts of our lives, We want to keep our testimony pure..not because we think we are better than others who do drink, but because we are comparing ourselves to the one who is perfect.
God is not finished with any one of us. We must be careful to not act in ways that would cause others to stumble. For that reason among others, it is good to abstain. I think the motives behind our decision must always be to honor God, and consider our brothers and sisters in Christ regarding making this decision.
God will convict those who are His by His Holy Spirit...and the conviction may vary between people. Getting drunk is never open for discussion.. others have addressed that here already.
my thoughts...for what it's worth..
Blessings, Carla
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Permalink Reply by Ginnybee on
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I always thought the sin in alcoholism had more to do with improper motivations than with conditions of drunkenness. To become drunk is foolishness, which relates closely to sin; however, mistakenly becoming drunk does not in its self qualify one's action as sin. A person’s motive for drinking alcohol is the real factor needing inspection. If someone drinks excessively, or on a routine basis, there is probably a motivational glitch challenging that person. Feeding the glitch is what I would presume the likely sin. Additionally, once an individual enters a state of drunkenness, he/she generally is more likely to act out sinfully due to a faltered ability to think wisely, but the inevitable altered-state-of-conscience caused by drinking too much is not the actual sin. That’s just my own view, though.
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See I was missing you so much Glenda that I spend a couple of hours thinking, what topic will get my sis out into the forum again????? Ohhh I know!!! And Bingo hahahaaha The rest is history hahaahaha
A person’s motive for drinking alcohol is the real factor needing inspection
Great comment. We know drug and alcohol use are the outcome of a root problem in general, though I have known folks who are adamant about their like for drugs or alcohol to be the reason they use, but I do not agree with them, I think there is something (the void) below the surface that they still have not pin point.
Love you sis
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hahaha... thanks for your thoughts! I missed you also, bro. And congrats on becoming one of AAG's moderators :)
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Glenda
Hey how can someone become mistakenly drunk? Were they drinking wine thinking it was cool aid hahaahaha
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haha... Aren't you a comedian. Actually, it happens... I know first hand. But I'm sure that never happened to youuuuu. :D later gater
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Permalink Reply by Addaneye Michael on
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Scripture has much to say regarding the drinking of alcohol (Leviticus 10:9; Numbers 6:3; Deuteronomy 29:6; Judges 13:4, 7, 14; Proverbs 20:1; 31:4; Isaiah 5:11, 22; 24:9; 28:7; 29:9; 56:12). However, Scripture does not necessarily forbid a Christian from drinking beer, wine, or any other drink containing alcohol. In fact, some Scriptures discuss alcohol in positive terms. Ecclesiastes 9:7 instructs, “Drink your wine with a merry heart.” Psalm 104:14-15 states that God gives wine “that makes glad the heart of men.” Amos 9:14 discusses drinking wine from your own vineyard as a sign of God’s blessing. Isaiah 55:1 encourages, “Yes, come buy wine and milk…”
What God commands Christians regarding alcohol is to avoid drunkenness (Ephesians 5:18). The Bible condemns drunkenness and its effects (Proverbs 23:29-35). Christians are also commanded to not allow their bodies to be “mastered” by anything (1 Corinthians 6:12; 2 Peter 2:19). Drinking alcohol in excess is undeniably addictive. Scripture also forbids a Christian from doing anything that might offend other Christians or encourage them to sin against their conscience (1 Corinthians 8:9-13). In light of these principles, it would be extremely difficult for any Christian to say he is drinking alcohol in excess to the glory of God (1 Corinthians 10:31).
Jesus changed water into wine. It even seems that Jesus drank wine on occasion (John 2:1-11; Matthew 26:19). In New Testament times, the water was not very clean. Without modern sanitation, the water was often filled with bacteria, viruses, and all kinds of contaminants. The same is true in many third-world countries today. As a result, people often drank wine (or grape juice) because it was far less likely to be contaminated. In 1 Timothy 5:23, Paul was instructing Timothy to stop drinking the water (which was probably causing his stomach problems) and instead drink wine. In that day, wine was fermented (containing alcohol), but not necessarily to the degree it is today. It is incorrect to say that it was grape juice, but it is also incorrect to say that it was the same thing as the wine commonly used today. Again, Scripture does not forbid Christians from drinking beer, wine, or any other drink containing alcohol. Alcohol is not, in and of itself, tainted by sin. It is drunkenness and addiction to alcohol that a Christian must absolutely refrain from (Ephesians 5:18; 1 Corinthians 6:12).
Alcohol, consumed in small quantities, is neither harmful nor addictive. In fact, some doctors advocate drinking small amounts of red wine for its health benefits, especially for the heart. Consumption of small quantities of alcohol is a matter of Christian freedom. Drunkenness and addiction are sin. However, due to the biblical concerns regarding alcohol and its effects, due to the easy temptation to consume alcohol in excess, and due to the possibility of causing offense and/or stumbling of others, it is usually best for a Christian to abstain entirely from drinking alcohol.Scripture has much to say regarding the drinking of alcohol (Leviticus 10:9; Numbers 6:3; Deuteronomy 29:6; Judges 13:4, 7, 14; Proverbs 20:1; 31:4; Isaiah 5:11, 22; 24:9; 28:7; 29:9; 56:12). However, Scripture does not necessarily forbid a Christian from drinking beer, wine, or any other drink containing alcohol. In fact, some Scriptures discuss alcohol in positive terms. Ecclesiastes 9:7 instructs, “Drink your wine with a merry heart.” Psalm 104:14-15 states that God gives wine “that makes glad the heart of men.” Amos 9:14 discusses drinking wine from your own vineyard as a sign of God’s blessing. Isaiah 55:1 encourages, “Yes, come buy wine and milk…”
What God commands Christians regarding alcohol is to avoid drunkenness (Ephesians 5:18). The Bible condemns drunkenness and its effects (Proverbs 23:29-35). Christians are also commanded to not allow their bodies to be “mastered” by anything (1 Corinthians 6:12; 2 Peter 2:19). Drinking alcohol in excess is undeniably addictive. Scripture also forbids a Christian from doing anything that might offend other Christians or encourage them to sin against their conscience (1 Corinthians 8:9-13). In light of these principles, it would be extremely difficult for any Christian to say he is drinking alcohol in excess to the glory of God (1 Corinthians 10:31).
Jesus changed water into wine. It even seems that Jesus drank wine on occasion (John 2:1-11; Matthew 26:19). In New Testament times, the water was not very clean. Without modern sanitation, the water was often filled with bacteria, viruses, and all kinds of contaminants. The same is true in many third-world countries today. As a result, people often drank wine (or grape juice) because it was far less likely to be contaminated. In 1 Timothy 5:23, Paul was instructing Timothy to stop drinking the water (which was probably causing his stomach problems) and instead drink wine. In that day, wine was fermented (containing alcohol), but not necessarily to the degree it is today. It is incorrect to say that it was grape juice, but it is also incorrect to say that it was the same thing as the wine commonly used today. Again, Scripture does not forbid Christians from drinking beer, wine, or any other drink containing alcohol. Alcohol is not, in and of itself, tainted by sin. It is drunkenness and addiction to alcohol that a Christian must absolutely refrain from (Ephesians 5:18; 1 Corinthians 6:12).
Alcohol, consumed in small quantities, is neither harmful nor addictive. In fact, some doctors advocate drinking small amounts of red wine for its health benefits, especially for the heart. Consumption of small quantities of alcohol is a matter of Christian freedom. Drunkenness and addiction are sin. However, due to the biblical concerns regarding alcohol and its effects, due to the easy temptation to consume alcohol in excess, and due to the possibility of causing offense and/or stumbling of others, it is usually best for a Christian to abstain entirely from drinking alcohol. Shalom!
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Permalink Reply by Michael Vernon McEntire on
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Oh, for goodness sake, stop all that silliness about Jesus drinking wine because it was healthier than the water! He invented fermentation!
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Permalink Reply by Travis Samson on
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Sarah,
This probably sounds like the same thing that others say, but still what I did is just ask the Lord what he would like of me and to show me what to get rid of in my life so that I could live completely for him. Well I recently when on R&R back home because I am deployed in the military and I tried to drink a beer and it didn't taste bad but I just lost the appetite for it. That told me that God did not want me to drink, but it may be different for other people because He knows all and for some people addiction is easy to fall into so maybe those more than others he would want you to not partake in the consumption of alcohol no matter the amount.
Sorry to ramble on this is just what it felt like he wanted me to say about the subject hope it helped.
have a great day and God bless
Travis lee
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