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Witnessing: Please give me scriputre where it clearly states that Jesus is God.
Im witnessing and reaching out to a VERY prominent cult group here in SLC Utah. I understand thier faith very well. I research it and compare it to the bible continuously. I do not just come to the conclusion that the faith is wrong until I have thier scriptures to clearly back up what I know about them and what the bible says. It is a very decieving religion. But anyway, I need scriptur to back the fact up that Jesus is God. I know a few, but it isnt totally clear. Help???
Thank you!
Thank you!
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Hey Ron, my brother in the Lord,
It has been too long. I took time away from responding to forums as I tired of the same old stuff coming up by new people thinking they have found a new way to attack sound doctrine and try to prove it wrong. We have seen the same three doctrines (Trinity/Deity of Jesus, Hell/death, Sabbath) attacked over and over again using the same old errant arguments.
We are in very interesting times. There has always been false teachers and doctrine since the earliest of days, but now with the various mediums the spread of these doctrines is accelorating. As much as I tire of the same old rhetoric, I cannot sit back and see errant doctrines being propogated with the possibility of misleading others into their same error.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Permalink Reply by Siphokazi on
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Greetings again in 2010 Paula
I have noticed that you associate me with the anti-christ.
You can rank me as you like, but the Judge who is to come will judge me fairly.
I won't allow the devil to break my spirit.
Jesus said before Abraham was, I am.
Jesus came in flesh and He will return in flesh.
When I say He is the Spirit is because He was there before the all things were created, even before He became flesh.
I love Isaiah 6:8 which says:
Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying, "Whom shall I send? And who will go for us?" And I said, "Here am I. Send me!"
It is Jesus who says "Here am I. Send me!
By this Jesus was not born in flesh but He was ever there in Spirit.
And Paula when you say, "Jesus come into my heart, I accept you as my Lord and Savour"
Who enters your heart Paula?
Is it Flesh or Spirit?
When we say Jesus is Omni present and Omnipotence, what do we mean? Can you see Jesus now Paula?
I see your Jesus is Flesh. Mine who walks around and with me when I go through the waters and when I go through the fire is Spirit.
Otherwise if He is flesh I will have to wait for judgement day to see Him.
I have seen my Jesus thousand times and He whisper into my ear everyday.
I love this Jesus of mine.
Keep yours Paula and I will Keep mine.
To your eyes I might be an anti-christ, but to Him I am the heir of Heaven
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On th 25th of December I was not around you sent me the same message of antichrist in me. I am replying to that
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Permalink Reply by JENNI S. FORRO on
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TITUS 2:13, Isaiah 6:9....THATS ALL AS FAR AS I IKNOW BUR STILL THIER IS STILL A LOT OF VERSES...GOD BLESS FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT OF FAITH
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Hi Jenni
You are right, we have to fight the good fight of faith.
Ephesians 6:12 say:
For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.
The devil has come to still, to kill and destroy.
The devil waits for an opportune time and when he gets that time he uses it, but mostly its us Christians who give the devil that time.
Lets be vigilant that he does not use anything against us.
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I was reading what we were talking about and I checked what hellofull had said. I realized that my statement and hellofull are not the same at all but you refer to us both as antichrist.
Now I am wondering if you truly understand the meaning of antchrist
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All these are questions as I am trying to understand.
Let me make it simple.
According to you when did Jesus Christ come to existence?
1. When He was born
2. Before He was born
3. After He was born
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Hi Paula
I can see we will talk about this until Jesus come. This is my conclsion.
You have missed my point altogether. Which is about Jesus Christ being the Spirit.
I said I know that Jesus Christ was born in flesh like any human being
He died for my sins and He rose again
He has ascended to heaven in flesh and He is seated on the right hand of the Father.
You sent me this scripture:
1 John 4:3 (New King James Version)
and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world.
How I can I say I am born again without acknowledging that Jesus Christ came in flesh and died for my sins.
Which is why asked you if you know the meaning of antichrist.
Going back to my point of Jesus Christ being the Spirit is here:
The bible states that everything came to existence because of Him(Jesus Christ).
Jesus existed before He became flesh. He existed being the Spirit.
That Spirit never died because He became flesh.
That Spirit still exist among us even to this day.
Look at this scripture:
Hebrews 10:5 (New International Version)
Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said:
"Sacrifice and offering you did not desire,
but a body you prepared for me.
The body was prepared for Christ but His Spirit ever existed.
I asked you these questions that you never answered:
1. Before Jesus was born He existed as what? Flesh or Spirit?
2. When you say Jesus come into my heart, I accept you as my Lord ans Saviour, who enters your heart? Flesh or Spirit?
3. If all thing existed because of Him. By then was He Flesh or Spirit?
4. When He says the following scripture, who are you expecting to see, the Flesh or the Spirit?
Revelation 3:20
Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will eat with him, and he with me.
If you looking at the flesh, which I am not saying don't, you will say you never saw Jesus in your life and you will wait till the judgement day to see Him in Flesh.
I have seen Jesus in my life Spiritually and I am waiting to see Him physically on judgement day, of which this statement does not deny that He came in Flesh and will again come back in Flesh
Myself I acknowledge Jesus as the Flesh and the Spirit
In your case, you only ackowledge the Flesh.
If this is the case, you have denied Christ's existence before He became Flesh.
Now I live you with these scriptures.
Please go out there and learn more about Spiritual things than Flesh.
Romans 8:9
Listen to this passage
You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ
Galatians 5:25
Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit
Thanks Paula for your input andGod bless you.
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Permalink Reply by Lori Fitzpatrick on
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Ron....You are so right. I love the way you explained that.
Awhile back when I was "so called" searching, I attended a few JW halls. And soon realized the problem.
The John 1:1 example is perfect. They get very angry when you try to question or try to reason yourself. It is all memorize the way we tell you.
Thank you Ron for an intellegent response.
May the Lord continue to Bless you
Lori
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Permalink Reply by Graham Robert Maidment on
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I am getting very confused myself here as I also belive that Jesus and god are different. As Jesus is the son of God?
Mathew 26 v 39: He went on a little farther and fell face down on the ground, praying.
" My Farther! If it is possible, let this cup of suffering be taken away from me. Yet I want your will, not mine.
I am only using this as part of the sciptures, their are many scriptures in the Bible that state Jesus the son.
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Hi Graham
I understand your confusion, but Jesus is God
To understand and believe that Jesus is God is to understand God's main motive of becoming human.
Firstly He had to die for our sins.
Secondly, God came to teach us the way to live and that's what christianity is about, to live like Christ.
For you to understand this, lets go back a bit to the good leaders that were in the bible:
Moses, David, Gideon, Elijah, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego and many more
These were great and powerful men of the bible, but all had their own weaknesses like any other human being.
A leader is someone we look at and most time we do what they do. Lets look at things we might copy and do based on these leaders: I am not judging them, which is why God decided to come so that there will be not even a little mistake.
Moses anger, David's uncontrolled temptations, Gideon's little faith (Thomas faith) he believed by sight at first, Elijah's fear, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego their "if" statement shows doubt, and many more
But God decided not to appoint any leader but to come Himself to show us that we can live a sinless life.
God's motive in all the pain and shame He went through was a way of preparing us, showing us that we can do all things if we trust in Him.
I agree with you, Jesus did pray, but take a little minute a think about it. He could have done everything in a minute, but we are humans we will go through certain things that He went through which is part of preparing us.
Jesus kept on saying " My Farther! If it is possible, let this cup of suffering be taken away from me. Yet I want your will, not mine". All this Jesus did for us as a teacher. Do not look only at what He went through, but understand the motive behind, which is to teach us how to deal with the daily trial and tribulations of this life.
There are areas where He acted immediately like changing water into wine, which teaches us that there certain things that need immediate action.
He was tempted and endured all. The temptations that He went was the way of showing us that we will go through the same but we must resist the devil and he will flee from us.
John 8:56-59 "'Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.' 57 The Jews therefore said to Him, 'You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?' 58 Jesus said to them, 'Truly truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.' 59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself, and went out of the temple
John 14:8-9 "Philip said to Him, 'Lord show us the Father, and it is enough for us.' 9Jesus said to him, 'Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say, 'Show us the Father?'" Where Jesus says, "I have been" is in the Greek present tense, 'ego eimi'. Literally, again, this is "I am
Exodus 3:13-14 (New International Version)
13 Moses said to God, "Suppose I go to the Israelites and say to them, 'The God of your fathers has sent me to you,' and they ask me, 'What is his name?' Then what shall I tell them?"
14 God said to Moses, "I am who I am . [a] This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM has sent me to you.' "
"Hear O Israel: the Lord our God, the Lord is one." ( Mark 12:29)
"I and the Father are one." ( John 10:30)
"I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you know me, you will know my Father also." ( John 14:6-7)
Looking at this statement alone, Jesus says if we know Him we know the Father, is int this enough to know that God did for our sins. Those who have seen Jesus physically have seen the Father, and us who have seen Him Spiritually have seen the Father.
But Jesus answered them, 'My Father is working still, and I am still working.' This was why the Jews sought all the more to kill him, because he not only broke the sabbath, but also called God his own Father, making himself equal with God. ( John 5:16-18)
"Whoever hates me hates my Father also." ( John 15:23)
John 1:3-5
Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it.
John 4:24 (New King James Version)
God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth
2 John 1:7
Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.
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