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Victoria Osteen & the response
Victoria Osteen – the “response” that shows she is a typical false teacher
by Sandy Simpson, 9/8/14
It never ceases to amaze me how people who claim to be “Christian” leaders are apparently NEVER able to admit when they are wrong. Makes you wonder if they are born again because acceptance of the Gospel will cause a person to repent of their sins which then gives them access to the forgiveness of Christ when they sin from that point on (1 John 1:9). But be that as it may, Victoria, the “co-pastor” and wife of Joel Osteen, fires back at the article in the Christian Post entitled: “Victoria Osteen Ripped for Telling Church 'Just Do Good For Your O... by claiming they lied about what she said. She claims in her statement back to them in the article called “Victoria Osteen Chides Critics: I Didn't Mean Parishioners Shouldn... that they claimed that she said a person should not worship God.
"While I admit that I could have been more articulate in my remarks, I stand by my point that when we worship God and are obedient to Him we will be better for it," she told The Blaze in a statement Friday. "I did not mean to imply that we don't worship God; that's ridiculous, and only the critics and cynics are interpreting my remarks that way." (Christian Post, “Victoria Osteen Chides Critics: I Didn't Mean Parishioners Shouldn...)
That is not what they said at all. The title of the article is very specific in their correct analysis of her “ridiculous” statement – that she stated that “worship is not for God, it is for yourself”. So she lied in her response.
But the real problems are that she claims the following in her response:
"I just want to encourage every one of us to realize when we obey God, we're not doing it for God—I mean, that's one way to look at it—we're doing it for ourselves, because God takes pleasure when we're happy," she said in the 36-second clip posted on YouTube, with her husband smiling at her side. "That's the thing that gives Him the greatest joy … So, I want you to know this morning: Just do good for your own self. Do good because God wants you to be happy," she continued. "When you come to church, when you worship Him, you're not doing it for God really. You're doing it for yourself, because that's what makes God happy. Amen?" the clip ended as congregants cheered. (Christian Post, “Victoria Osteen Chides Critics: I Didn't Mean Parishioners Shouldn...)
So she not only did not apologize for her statements and lied about how people quoted her, but she reiterated their same, tired, false Word of Faith teaching again. She states that worshipping God is not for Him but for us. Why? Because when we are happy that makes God happy. Oh really? What about the stories of Job, Stephen, Paul suffering from a “thorn”, and all the other prophets and apostles who died serving God? They were not worshipping God so they could be “happy”, they were worshipping God because of Who He is!
Victoria has also not read the Bible, which you would think would be a requirement for someone to be a head pastor of a church. The Bible is clear that the thing that brings God “joy” is our obedience.
John 14:15 "If you love me, you will obey what I command.
John 14:23 Jesus replied, "If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.
John 14:24 He who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.
John 15:10 If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father’s commands and remain in his love.
1 John 5:3 This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome,
Love and worship for God is not predicated on how we feel or the amount of joy we have. It is predicated on obedience to Him BECAUSE HE IS GOD! Victoria also tells her audience that they need to “do good because God wants you to be happy”. We don’t do good so WE can be happy. That may be a consequence of doing good, at times, but the important thing is that, in the most difficult circumstances, we simply obey Him because we know He will be pleased with us on that basis. But our “happiness” is not the end. But it is for the Osteens. Almost every word of every message from them is the New Thought idea that we can create our own little world of happiness by simply thinking and speaking positively. I have written about this idea, which is basically Karma, in an article entitled “Karma (by any other name)”. God wants us to submit our will to His, not willfully try to create our own reality that is often not in line with His purposes.
Finally, the scary part is that the “congregants cheered” after Victoria finishes her diatribe. This reminds me of a warning from the Old Testament against heretics like the Osteens:
Jeremiah 5:31 The prophets prophesy lies, the priests rule by their own authority, and my people love it this way. But what will you do in the end?
Someday every person who has ever been born on this earth will answer to God for their actions. You can either fool yourself into thinking you are happy because of your positive thoughts and confessions, or you can follow God and obey Him, thus proving your love for Him. Better choose correctly because “what will you do in the end?”
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Tammy on
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Great site to answer any questions you may have about God's creation https://answersingenesis.org
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Permalink Reply by RoyW on
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Eric,
May I first ask in which category you would place yourself? It appears to me that you believe that man has evolved from lower forms. In your understanding, then, Adam had a dad other than God. Is this correct. His dad would not be relevant in the history of Israel or God's plan of redemption of man but a dad nevertheless. Is this correct. So far in our discussion I have been pretty generous is sharing my ideas. As you know, I believe Adam is a special creation of God with no previous ancestor. I don't believe he evolved from any previous primitive person or animal. Are you comfortable enough with us or me to share what you believe about Adam.
There are young-earth creationists, progressive creationists, theistic evolutionists, old-earth theorists, gap creation theorists and more. How would you define yourself? It sounds as if you believe that other men lived concurrently with Adam.
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Eric,
Either all of us young earthers are stupid or that abundance of evidence must be more of speculation than actual proof of age. I am waiting on this art interpretation that you speak of. You will have to be very descriptive since someone labeled me as left-brain dominance. I think you are the opposite. Just make sure that you are not wanting to see something that isn't there. No worry, there will always be people like myself around that will bring you back to reality.
It seems incredible that life could have only been around some six thousand years. I could say could you agree to at least the possibility of a young earth? You might say the same to me but I am captured by Scripture which tells me that around forty-five hundred years ago there was a great flood over the whole earth that left this world looking like what we see today. I think, to you, the ark is only a picture of a future rapture or something. To me, it is an actual event that reshaped the whole world.
What pictures are you seeing or are you simply speculating that there might be some pictures that we aren't seeing? What is your final authority? Is the speculation of man the final authority or Scripture? I think if you come to the conclusion that there were humans before Adam, you will need to come up with something very convincing. The Bible tells us that Adam was the first man. You say that he was just the first important man in the plan of God. I cannot reconcile those two views. Can you give me an example of the picture that shows you that?
I know you do not want to be defined. However, if you believe that God was in charge of creation but that He used some form of evolution to get us to Adam, that makes you a theistic evolutionist. Darwin felt he had adequately explained how life may have evolved from a lower species. The one thing that troubled him was the lack of fossil evidence. He was troubled by the Cambrian Explosion some 500 million years ago. One hundred and fifty years ago he felt he could rest easy feeling assured that eventually these millions and billions of fossils displaying intermediate life would be found. But, here we are, one hundred and fifty years later with still no good explanation of that sudden explosion of life shown by the fossil evidence. The evidence shows that an abundance of life forms sprung into being over a very short period of time. I think the Bible's version is what is supported. Where are those billions and billions of fossils proving Darwin's theory. They simply do not exist.
If God is showing us a picture of millions of years of evolutionary tracks, why did He do such a good job of hiding all those fossils? Okay, we are being told that we just haven't drilled deep enough but we have drilled quite extensively looking for oil. Yes, we are looking for new ways to drill deeper than every before looking for those fossils. Maybe those fossils are hidden below the earth's surface more than ten miles deep.
You know what I think? I don't think those fossils have been found simply because they do not exist. You say there is an abundance of evidence. I say there is no real evidence of these earlier life forms. What is all this evidence you speak of, Eric. Is this evidence based on a philosophical platform that the record of the Bible is nothing more than a fairy tale? We are teaching our children in our schools that life began on earth millions of years ago. Why are we doing that? The Bible clearly tells us that life began just a few thousand years ago. Why are we so quick to dismiss the record of the only Person that was there in the beginning?
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Permalink Reply by Seek on
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I am captured by Scripture which tells me that around forty-five hundred years ago there was a great flood over the whole earth that left this world looking like what we see today.
Hmm this got me to thinking. I know, scary right?
And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. Genesis 1:6
Unless I'm misreading something, the water was here before earth was created. The water therefore is older. And when that completely covered the earth, I'd think it would have had to create havoc with the appearance of age. Now you know why thinking hurts my brain.
;-)
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Wow! That was a good one. You will not have a problem finding those to agree with you that I am a simple minded person. My wife could give greater insight to that but I am not going to tell her about this one. I think a better explanation, however, is that I am looking for the simplest interpretation of what is being said. When you say simple stories I am assuming you are talking about things like Creation, the Flood, Abraham's story, the parting of the Sea, the sun standing still, Samson, Jonah and more. I think maybe saying that I actually think that Job had seen dinosaurs is too much of a stretch as well.
Are there any miracles that you accept as true or do you think they all require a deeper interpretation. Did Jesus really rise from the dead? I am not being frivolous. Are there miracles that you accept as true and literal?
If I am not qualified to read the Bible and know what it is saying, who is? I mentioned I was accused of only having the left side of my brain working. I really don't believe in that. I think I am competent to read the Bible and understand it. The difference between you and me is that you are looking to change what I understand the Bible to be saying through interpretation.
Eric, I think I do understand you. I am just not seeing evidence of what you are saying. The only reason I believe in six days is simply because that is what He said. If He had said billions of years, that is what I would believe simply because He was the only one there to know what He did, how He did it and how long it took Him to do it.
You are not wasting my time. At my age it is good to keep the electricity flowing through my brain. I do have a problem. I can prove to you that any two sides of a triangle have greater length than the third side. I would have to use Euclid's Axioms. That is the kind of proof that I am looking for. I know that kind of proof does not exist.
Well, I hope you don't quit but if you do, thank you for your time. You are not wasting my time.
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Eric,
Here is a picture. It is the Teton National Park in my home state of beautiful Wyoming:
Eric, why would God make something like this? What does this picture tell you? You have a gift. Maybe the purpose of that gift is not to show how the earth is very old making some philosopher happy, but showing us different insights into God. Where is God? Where does He live? Obviously He is not confined to this universe since He existed outside the universe. How big is God if He has the power to create such images? Are you sure you are using your gift in the way God intended?
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I don't know why either He made the mountains, trees, flowers and lakes. In them, I see He is beyond even our imaginations. I agree it is way too cheap to sell out Scripture simply to make some agnostic or atheistic philosopher happy. So, that leaves the evidence. Where is the abundance of evidence? Is it in the geological layers or the man-made dating systems. Is it in the size of our universe? Is it in the expansion of the universe or the circular reasoning of extinction? All of this leaves me wondering why we so quickly dismiss Genesis. Surely it is much more.
I guess I am not suggesting that we get rid of the mountains. All that you speak of will one day be toppled. What is man's value? I see that man has no value without His God. Without His Word we are completely lost. The only thing that counts in this world is faith acting in love. We measure man by his works (art and other), accomplishments, successes, looks and power. God does not use that form of measurements. He chooses the weak to confound the strong - the foolish things to shame the wise. The child moves past the rich and mighty in God's eyes.
No poetry here, just simple thinking and still wondering why you are suggesting I consider the six days as billions of years.
On the other hand, I did enjoy your poem. Did you write that? It is very good.
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Thank you, Eric. Now, I do feel better. You had me worried there for a minute. I have been outside working this afternoon and came in to read that I was a simple minded person. I was disappointed.
In my most recent post before this one I did ask you if there were any miracles that you believe are true and literal. I'm pretty sure that you do and I am not trying to discount your thinking. I would be interested if you have ever considered the question. Which miracles do you consider true and literal? Which of the ones I mentioned do you think really happened? Of course, Creation in six days would be a huge one. Of course, none of these things could happen without God's supernatural intervention. I know that you have indicated that this is not the issue but nevertheless, I am still curious.
Well, I get to go out for the evening. I will probably check before I retire for posts.
Blessings.
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Beautiful picture. I love the fall colors. I miss them now that I'm in TX. I use to get to see that beauty every year in NC. Here it's just summer, summer & winter.
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ROFL. October of last year got cold & it stayed cold until March. Snow days & all.
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Permalink Reply by David Velasquez on
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Roy,
My brother from another mother, but the same Father haha! If i don't see you on this side of heaven again, I sure hope we have long walks on the next.
Much love to you my brother.
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