King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.) No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.
King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.) And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live.
Ok, when the subject was brought up in the past these scriptures were used. I know people have seen God (read I think it's Genesis 18). I'm not sure what to say. For I know if I use Genesis 18 they'll say that it wasn't God it was just an angel.
What do I say concerning these scriptures when they say no man has seen God so that proves Jesus can't be God?
Christ appeared to Abraham as a man, just as He walked this earth as a man. Prior to His birth, I would say He was spirit. Spirits can enter into men...or animals. Christ's awesomeness was covered because of Him being a man. A good study of this, as far as topics go, would be the study of Spirit, Soul, Body.
Revelation, Chapter 1, gives us a description of Christ. John saw Him trough a vision (I believe). That description in this chapter shows you the awesomeness of Christ in His natural form.
Moses saw Him from a cleft in a rock and then only saw His back. There is also a description of the Father in the Old Testament.
An important thing to study, is who is the person speaking of...Christ, the Son or the Father or the Holy Spirit. All 3 of them make up God.
I would like to add that the study of Spirit Soul Body and the Trinity gave me understanding on how to read the Bible and to get more understanding from it.
Blessings in your continued studies.....
The problem is they don't believe Jesus appeared as God....they believe it was an angel (not sure which one). Now I'm getting confused...My mind is tied up in confusion. :( Pray God gives me wisdom.
Blessings to you,
Philip said to Jesus, "Lord, show us the Father. That is all we need."
Jesus answered, "Philip, I have been with you for a long time. So you should know me. The person that has seen me has seen the Father too. So why do you say, 'Show us the Father'? Do you truly believe that I am in the Father and the Father is in me? The things I have told you don't come from me. The Father lives in me, and he is doing his own work. Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me. Or believe because of the miracles I have done."
Jesus is the Father’s revelation of himself.
If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him." John 14:7
No one has ever seen the Father as a Spirit. We have seen God the son, who reveals God the Father and we have seen manifestations of the Father, but never the Father as a Spirit.
Thanks David for trying to help. I'm really confused right now though...I know they could easily turn those verses around to fit their own doctrine...
Cults always do that. It is not up to you to convince them. Your responsibility is only to present the truth, the gospel. The rest is up to the Word of God, the Holy Spirit and them. If you think you will win them over you are mistaken. They have to be won over by God, for God alone can save. Share the truth in love and leave it in God's hands.
Thanks LT...you're right.
Do you know any verses for comfort for this situation? I really need it right now.
With what you are facing I think it is broader than a verse here or there. I encourage you to read 1 John.
Thank you brother, I will.
The Holy Spirit is pacient. He knows why I've had fear. So, He slowely teaches me things. He takes me by the hand and is pacient while "I have my moments" (which you've probably seen on here often). He finds ways so I can be comforted, whether it's in a verse, a person or whatever He knows is best.
He has me calmer than I was earlier. He doesn't expect me to do everything at once. And, I thank Him for that. I think what I've been told for now is to show them love. He's helping me to slowly (which is good for me He knows I need things done slowly-I'm a slow learner) learn to trust Him more. And if I go into a moment of doubt He will eventually pick me back up and urge me to repent. Actually, I didn't know the Holy Spirit too well until He used this situation, persecuted Christians and you brothers and sisters in Christ on AAG to help me out.
I don't want to do things too fast. I want to make sure I get His ok before I go into witnessing. But, now I know He wants me to do things in love, to show them love. That doesn't mean I can sit here idle all day eating and not giving it a thought :-). On the contrary, I still need to look up verses; to find answers. For ex. if one of them ask me a question refering to the deity of Christ. Well, before I'm asked I better start searching for answers (Matt. 7:7). That way it won't make Christ or me look foolish.
The Holy Spirit, I've gotton alot closer to Him. He seemed so distant before. It's like...it's like a friendship. He helps me when I'm hurting. This is actually great bonding time, you could call it! Praise God!
It'd be awesome to eventually trust Him enough to the point of knowing He will do the talking and not me. I'm not to that point yet. He's helping me to get there, but I've got to grow more in Him 1st.
I understand that frustration. It took a long time for me to embrace the role of a simple tool. The key is to not lose our love for them at the same time realizing that the outcome is not up to us as the tool.
God's truths are so beautiful.
All we can do is love them and let our life reflect the light of our Lord. God is the only one that can change men, but He does work through us, as we obey His leading.
David you mean like http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+5%3A13-14&v...
Matthew 5:13-14, right?
English Standard Version (ESV)
13 “You are the salt of the earth, but if salt has lost its taste, how shall its saltiness be restored? It is no longer good for anything except to be thrown out and trampled under people's feet.
14 “You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden.
Hallelujah!!!! Amen beloved.