All About GOD - Growing Relationships with Jesus and Others
danger of trusting in our fruit?
This has been on my mind for months now and it has only just become clear enough that I can actually verbalize a question out of it:
We are told that if we are truly saved, we must bear fruit (fruit of repentance, fruit of the Spirit come to mind). But isn't there a danger in trying to PROVE we are saved by trying to bear fruit?
Isn't this legalism, or depending on works for salvation?
And how do we keep from falling into this trap??
I remember learning that there was a movement in early American colonial times where people sensed this pitfall and so went to the extreme of denying the role or importance of bearing fruit.
Any thoughts or help is much appreciated!
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by David Velasquez on
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Show me your faith without works and i will show you my faith with works... James writes
works are indispensable, but they do nothing for our salvation. check out this old classic:
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Permalink Reply by Jenny on
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i have been reading an old discussion called "assurance of salvation" and i wonder if you can help me to understand something you said. you mentioned the reasons you have assurance and said that even a few times when you had been in habitual sin you still had assurance because of the conviction of the Holy Spirit. if you wouldn't mind, can you please let me know what you mean by this?
jenny
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Permalink Reply by Richard L. Broch, Sr. on
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Dear Jenny,
Difficult questions.....
Let's take a close look at several aspects.
Question - Which came first.......grace or trusting in our fruit?
Ephesians 2:8 explains, " For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God."............ It's always been grace...... never has.. and never will be ourselves.
In Luke, Chapter 17, verses 5 thru 6, the apostles were asking Jesus to increase their faith. Jesus answered with a summation of what a little faith could accomplish. Then..... then...He told them how they could increase their faith in verses 7 thru 10, New Living Translation Bible, (7) "When a servant comes in from plowing or taking care of sheep, he just doesn't sit down and eat.(8) He must first prepare his master's meal and serve him his supper before eating his own. (9) And the servant is not even thanked, because he is merely doing what he is supposed to do. (10) In the same way, when you obey me you should say, We are not worthy of praise. We are servants who have simply done our duty."
Think about it..... the master in this story is God... and the servant represents us, His children. It's all about our Heavenly Father....we serve Him first, always. How do we serve Him? by making Him #1 in our lives..... much prayer.....Bible study...giving....witnessing, Matthew 22:37-40. When you love someone, you want to please them and show your love......and this is important - you do it because you want to.....not because you think you're supposed to.
Example - Here in the Valley of the Sun, in Arizona, when grade schools are in session.... the street that runs past the school has signs out in the street for about 300 feet that spell out - SPEED LIMIT 20 MPH. And you can believe 99.9% of traffic are doing just that. As I observe these law-abiding drivers......I know that some are obeying because they want to....because for the kids' safety. And I know also, that some drivers are doing it because they have to....police cars are generally in the area watching. Same situation with Christians.....some go to church and do wonderful things in Jesus' name because they feel it is their duty (Compare Matthew 7: 21-23). The true believers who abide in Christ do these things because they abide in Him ( See John 15 :4 & 5).
Jesus says in Luke 9:23, "........If anyone wishes to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow Me."
Our Lord is talking about denying our old habits and worldly ways, and nailing them to the cross...as we are being sanctified. And that's exactly what Galatians 5 : 16 -17 are spelling out. Then verses 22 - 25 put the icing on the cake.
Is all this worth it? It all depends on where and how one wants to spend ETERNITY..........
Grace and Peace, Jenny.
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lots here to read up on and pray about, thanks, i will study these things
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when we are told to examine oureslves whether we be in the faith, i'm assuming this means to examine whether we are producing fruit, as an indicator of whether we are saved. can someone please tell me how this is different from trusting in our works for salvation?
thanks in advance!
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thanks Char, that was a blessing to read. i think i am now where you used to be, wondering if i'm displaying any fruit, and it has me in despair because what stands out is my sin and i don't want to do good works and be legalistic about it.
i feel like if i can only have 100% assurance that i'm saved, i'll be so happy and the "works" will come naturally because of the joy of salvation.
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Jenny,
Oswald Chambers, from the U.K. in the early 1900's wrote a lot of good stuff regarding the Lord Jesus Christ.
Here's a timely excerpt that might help you during this time -
"Christians should not have their minds priority- centered on "God-Doing", but on "God-Being". What does that mean?
It means:
The most important aspect of Christianity is not the work we do, but it is the relationship with Christ we maintain and the surrounding influence and qualities produced by that relationship.
That is all God asks us to give our attention to, and it is the one thing that we continually struggle with."
So, what is being said here - Just concentrate your mind and heart on Jesus....and everything else will fall into place.
Grace and Peace.
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Jenny,
Along with what Richard posted I will add the following:
The "doing" flows from a right heart (right because of His work in us) in relationship with Jesus. We do not "do" to gain or maintain a right heart. We also do not "do" to gain or maintain a relationship. It is all to be an outflow of what God is doing in us.
There is a right way to live and a right reason to live that way. We desire to live for Him, to please Him, because we love Him.
Lord Bless,
LT
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