All About GOD - Growing Relationships with Jesus and Others
The Value of Suffering
What is the value of suffering? How has God worked in your life through suffering? What have you learned from suffering?
It seems to me that all of the Apostles suffered, in various ways. Jesus suffered unimaginably. What is it that God does in us through suffering, that cannot be done other ways?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Sarah Gardener on
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Very true title to this discussion Scribe - there is much value:
Share the sufferings of Christ:
1Pe 4:12 Beloved, do not be astonished at the fiery trial happening among you for your testing, as if a surprise were occurring to you;
1Pe 4:13 but according as you share the sufferings of Christ, rejoice; so that you may rejoice exultingly at the revelation of His glory.Patience for perfection and completeness lacking nothing:
Jas 1:2 My brothers count it all joy when you fall into various trials,
Jas 1:3 knowing that the proving of your faith works patience.
Jas 1:4 But let patience have its perfective work, that you may be perfect and complete, lacking nothing.Obedience:
Hebrews 12:6-7 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
These are some that are personal to me but I have found this article which is extremely beneficial:
God Bless
Linda Ruth
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Scibe,
My two cents:
Suffering (trials) need to be evaluated to understand them as best as possible. I ask myself four questions in order when facing a trial, including persecution, stopping at whatever questions provides the solution to my situation.
1. Am I in this mess because of my stupidity (sin)?
Did my sinful actions cause this mess. If the answer is "yes" I repent asking God to forgive me and seek to realign with Him. If it is not something I caused I then ask question 2.
2. What is God trying to teach me through this trial?
We often learn through trials as God works as the silversmith refining us. I have learned more lessons in the midst of trial than by smooth sailing. If I do not see a clear picture as to what God is teaching me I ask question 3.
3. What is God trying to teach others through my trial, remebering that life is not all about me?
How will my actions in the midst of a trial affect others? What will they learn about a disciple of Jesus and God Himself by how I go through this trial? Sometimes I do not see this clearly either. Then I go to question 4.
4. Will I trust God in the midst of this trial when it makes no sense to me? Another way of simply putting it is "Can I trust God?"
To me a great question is do I believe that Romans 8:28 is true and an applicable promise to me? The answer is yes and yes. Therefore, I must believe that God will work out what I am going through for my good everytime. This does not mean that there will be no pain or suffering, but the end results are guaranteed to be for my good.
God is my Father in heaven and I am His child thanks to Jesus Christ my Lord and Savior. I trust in His Word and in Him. Persecutions will come, but God, not the situation, is in control.
Lord BLess,
LT
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One of my favorite accounts in the Bible is when Peter walked on the water. We know that Jesus called to Him and He walked out onto the water. The storm is swirling around Him. He takes his eyes off of Jesus and focuses on the storm and begins to sink. He calls out to Jesus and Jesus reaches out and pulls him up and they get into the boat.
Several great lessons and some interesting thoughts come to mind.
1) Jesus called Peter out of the boat and into the storm.
2) He began to walk on the water in the midst of the storm.
3) The storm had no effect on him until he took his eyes off of Jesus.
4) He began to sink, the storm did not swallow him up. He sank because his loss of focus caused him to cease to walk on the water (which man can only do by the power of God). He stopped trusting Jesus and began to trust what his eyes were taking in around him.
5) He cries out and Jesus shows love and mercy by lifting him up and they enter the boat.
Food for thought: There is no declared answer to this thought, but what if Peter remained focused on Jesus in the storm? Would they have simply walked alongside the boat until they reached the shore? What I do know is that because of the storm Peter ended up right back where he started, in the boat. How often do we cry out "save me from the storm" instead of "guide me through the storm." Going through the storm (not of our own making) leads to growth. Being saved from the storm leads us back to where we were before the storm began. The three Hebrews in Daniel 3 were not spared the fire, but saved in the fire.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Yes, He helps us and we grow even in cases where we are in the storm because of personal sin, but as stated in the 4 steps above, we have no reason to expect help until we repent and align. He will use tools on us to get us to that stage, but we are in need of repenting and seeking to realign before progress can be truly made.
Thus, the difference between self-inflicted and trials not of our own making is the first step.
Hope that clears that up. If not, ask further.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Amanda,
In regards to two of your points:
1) The person who seeks to please God out of love and has a clear conscience according to Scripture can know that their suffering is not because of personal sin. There are people in jail around the world who went there because they preached the gospel. They did not sin and are not in jail because they sinned, but because of circumstances beyond their control.
2) I did not say that repentance would stop suffering due to sin. I said that we should repent and seek to align with God if we have sinned. In so doing we can be sure that we are walking in His will and have every reason to expect God to walk with us throught he trial.
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Amanda,
There are times things happen that we have no visible reason for. That is what number 4 is all about. Some times we see a specific lesson being taught to us and/or others. That is what numbers 2 and 3 refer to. Some times we are in the pit because of our actions. That is what number 1 refers to.
Regarding suffering 20 years later. This depends. Are we talking man's laws or God's God does not wait for you to align with Him and then go back 20 years to punush you today. That is simply hogwash that many ignorant people teach. No where in the NC will you find such a principle. Now, you may pay a penalty in the physical realm that is not excused. If one commits murder and the case is solved 20 years later they will arrest the person. Thus, repentance in the earthly realm is not the same as repenting before God and aligning with Him.
People need to stop listening to what others think of them and even what they think of themselves to understand who they are. We need to understand what God proclaims about us and live in that relationship with Him according to His Word.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Then you approach it all from a number 4 perspective whether you accept the numbers or not, unless of course the person does not trust God and then there are deeper issues than the current crisis a person finds them self in. To relegate it all to "that's just the way it is" is unfortunate, because there are things we can visibly see at times that God is trying to teach us or others. There are times we are in a mess because of personal sin and need to repent, but if we never evaluate it how would we know?
You are not offending me or persecuting me. This is open forum. You also do not have to accept my 4 question approach that I apply in my life. It is put out there for consideration, that's all,
Lord BLess,
LT
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Amanda,
The difference between legalistic adherance and walking in grace is the "why we do what we do." In the New Covenant there is a right way to live and we seek to abide and walk in Christ because we are saved and love Him. The legalist seeks to keep the command because of fear of condemnation.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Love triumph's. The fear (reverance) is a healthy fear, but fear of condemnation is unhealthy place to be for a believer when that belief under the NC is not true. Is it proven ... as far as Scripture proves it and it is lived out in the life of those who love Jesus and live for Him motivated by love and not fear. Therefore, not conjecture, but evidenced in the life of those who walk in the freedom and love provided by our Lord Jesus.
Lord Bless,
LT
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From the beginning I have said that there is a right way to live and a right reason to live that way. I do not do these things to be accepted, but rather because I am accepted. I desire to do what is right in order to please my heavenly Father. His love for me and mine for Him is my motivator. In the NC we have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. We are indwelt by the Holy Spirit who guides and convicts us.
Time is limited. I will try to address this in more detail later.
No, I do not own a fedora, but my youngest son does.
Lord Bless,
LT
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